From Kissing, Dating, and Lust to the Sovereign God

Author: Gary Shavey
POSTED ON: 05.01.06

The Reform & Resurge Conference is a week away and as we are setting up and addressing all the details I wanted to show this insightful interview with Joshua Harris. Most of you out there on the web checking out TheResurgence.com may be familiar with Joshua Harris' work on relationships with men and women, but you may want to be brought up to speed on Pastor Harris' recent work Stop Dating the Church!: Fall in Love with the Family of God his most recent work on relationships. This may be the most convicting of all his books. If you would like more background on Joshua Harris check out Mark Driscoll's past blog titled It's Like the Yankees of Missional Theology. (Joshua Harris' session at the Reform & Resurge Conference is titled: Humble Orthodoxy.)

GS: What do you think is the biggest issue the Church is facing today?

JH: To be honest, I'm doing well to make it week to week facing the issues in my local church. I don't know if I'm ready to try and tackle the biggest issue of the worldwide Church till all my kids are out of diapers!

But to try and answer your question, I think the big issue we face is the same one every generation of the Church has faced and that is to maintain an enduring loyalty to the gospel.

Here's why this is particularly difficult today: First, the idea of transcendent truth is out of step with our culture. Then, within the church, many are losing their grasp on the authority of Scripture, the doctrine of sin, and the centrality of Jesus and his atoning work. The good emphasis on reaching the lost that has shaped the seeker-sensitive movement has fostered an indifference to doctrine in general. People are more drawn to self-help solutions than a message that calls them sinners and displays a glorious Sovereign God who saves by grace alone. And I'll be the first to say that it's just plain hard to consistently train members to believe and live in the good of this central truth. It's so easy to stray into moralism, legalism, or into this or that cause.

GS: What do you think is the biggest issue facing Church planters today?

JH: Well one of the problems they face is when guys like me who have never planted a church try and give them advice!

Actually, I can think of a big issue, and that is comparing yourself to Mark Driscoll and getting discouraged. I deal with this issue, so I imagine it's even more acute for a church-planter. All across the country there are men thinking, Okay, I'm planting a church in Everytown, USA which is the most churched place on the planet and we have 9 members. Mark Driscoll is in Seattle where everyone worships Satan and his church grows by a thousand people every time I visit his blog. Lord, I quit.

GS: What's your advice to this discouraged church-planter?

JH: My counsel is to repeat these words whenever needed: I am not Mark Driscoll. I will never be Mark Driscoll. The world couldn't handle two Mark Driscolls anyway. Jesus loves me. I will keep preaching the gospel and leave the results to God. This has worked for me so far.

But seriously, I think comparison is an issue. Church-planting is hard work. Most churches will never grow to be mega-churches and that is okay. We need to make sure our definition of success is defined by God. It's just too easy to go online, find a half-dozen world-class pastors, see all God is doing through them and in their churches and then get discouraged. But that's not the issue. The issue is, are you being faithful? Are you preaching Christ and Him crucified? Are you caring for souls and winning the lost?

Your calling is not to be someone else or grow to a certain size. Brothers, this lost world needs men who will do faithful gospel ministry day in day out, even if it never makes headlines or no one asks you to write a book about it. Don't let the wrong definition of success lead you to give up.

GS: How is your session at the Reform & Resurge conference going to build, encourage or address these issues?

JH: Well, first I'd just like to note that I am not just speaking at the conference. I am opening for Tim Keller. That is huge. I am not above bragging about that. Have you ever gone to see a really incredible band and there was some no-name group that opened the show? Well that little band is me. No one will remember me, but I will have this moment proudly displayed in my scrapbook.

My session is still taking shape. I'm going to preach from 2 Timothy and basically I want to talk about what it means to stand by truth boldly, without being a jerk about it. In other words what does it look like for us to live a 'humble orthodoxy. These are questions I'm grappling with lately.

I'm really looking forward to the Reform & Resurge Conference. I know I'm going to learn and be personally challenged and I grew up near Portland, Oregon, so it will be good to get back to the Northwest. I'm also excited to meet and interact with the many young pastors who are coming. I hope we can encourage each other and leave more inspired to build gospel-centered churches that are faithfully striving forward in the mission of reaching the world.

Click here to view a complete itinerary and to register for this event.

Comment by Caleb Campbell on 05.16.06

To be honest, I was expecting some lightfooted ramblings about how dating is the end of mankind and courting will solve all our problems, but I was pleasantly surprised by Josh Harris. His message was convicting and challenging. Which is not what I expected.

Thanks for bringin him!

Caleb Campbell
www.encounteraz.com